The Walking Dead thread.

Posted by Roger 
Gcrush Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The first thing The Man does in a zombie
> apocalypse is distribute free meat-scented
> "survival" blankets to all the minorities.
>
Human-sized Beef Meximelts, tasty!

> I thought the transition from Merle pulling
> Darryl's shoe to the zombie munch-out was cool.
>
Yup.

> But I hated the awkwardness of most of Merle's
> lines. It was like a committee of Yankee writers,
> none of whom had ever been south of DC or west of
> Philly, was charged with portraying a Redneck
> stereotype saying, "Get up, faggot!" with the
> stipulation that they couldn't use any of those
> three words.
>
Just having Rooker back is golden. Awkward dialogue aside, I like the intent of those scenes, to reflect how much animosity still existed between Rick/the group and Daryl, how much he still disliked and distrusted them all. That scene with Rick pointing the gun at Daryl, yet again, was nice in terms of just character/plot consistency, especially with Daryl being played up as Han Solo more and more.

> Actually, the whole dream thing was odd. To be
> fair, I've never been shot with a crossbow, but I
> have never experienced hallucinations that were as
> coherent as Darryl's; they always been
> gobbledegook mash-ups of sensory information that
> were impossible to interpret. The trippy shit
> from Twin Peaks might be close to recreating them.
> That would have made for some cool stuff with
> zombies added in the mix.
>
A friend of mine once went on a 'shroom-fueled tour of Amsterdam. He claimed to have seen an enormous Muppet-like vagina in the building opposite the one he was staying in talking to him, dispensing advice on all sorts of topics. I promised him I would never repeat this story.

> So, does anyone know what was up with Darryl's
> squirrel sushi? Who eats 'em like that? Is it
> some kind of Bear Grylls survival technique to
> drink the juice from a rodent while tossing the
> piss-free parts away?
>
Well, he must have been dehydrated at that point. :)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/15/2011 12:28AM by gingaio.
SOILER?




Gcrush Wrote:
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> If they follow the comics, I'm guessing that
> they'll spend at least one or two more episodes at
> the farm before the zombies in the barn spill out
> and compel them to leave - somehow tying up the
> missing girl bit in the process. (Perhaps they
> found her as a zombie and penned her up with the
> rest?)

Did I call this or what? Damn, I'm good. Someone put me to work writing this shit.

The "mid-season finale" (what the fuck?) was one of the better episodes of late. It actually felt like a show about surviving a zombie apocalypse, characters were developed, and the plot marched assuredly forward. Nice.

Shane's dick-waving rise as an antagonist is turning out better than in the comics (in which it seemed rather abrupt). And, frankly, if they had tempered his psychotic melodrama a bit it would make for a more interesting showdown between him and Rick. As it stands, Shane is clearly supposed to be the unbalanced nutso who wants to kill whatever he can't fuck, whereas he could have been a compelling antihero. If Shane were toned down he would come across as a "Clint Eastwood" to Rick's "Boy Scout". Wouldn't that be a more interesting moral dilemma in the showdown?

Who would you side with - the guy who desperately wants to save everyone, or they guy who does whatever it takes to keep the group alive?
I am pleased with the second-half episodes so far...well, more pleased than with the first-half ones. I have some questions.

Was the Governor driving the truck?

Did Hershel just turn into Clint Eastwood and save the little Asian kid from some black thug (and what was the name of that movie again)?

Did Hershel just pull a Shane?

Did the black guy really have his entire probsoscis turned into sushi?

Did conniving Lori just step out of a Melrose Place episode?

Did Daryl just wear something with sleeves?

Is the blonde girl going to turn into Sophia?

Did Dale have any lines last night?

Will Andrea continue to look forlorn and tragic in profile?

The DEER! Whatever happened to the MOTHERF*&#%!NG DEER, Rick?

Will Rick trade his Python for a gun that shoots more than six rounds at a time? (And why did he pocket the spent casings in the bar?)

Will Nervous Nelly be sent to the glue factory?

When did a Hyundai become the sexy sleek ride for the show's badass?
gingaio Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am pleased with the second-half episodes so
> far...well, more pleased than with the first-half
> ones. I have some questions.

It seems to be moving at a less aggrivating pace.


> Was the Governor driving the truck?

Has he recovered from that scandel in California already?


> Did Hershel just turn into Clint Eastwood and save
> the little Asian kid from some black thug (and
> what was the name of that movie again)?

It was "Driving Miss Daisy", right?


> Did Hershel just pull a Shane?

Maybe Shane was pulling a Hershel all along...


> Did the black guy really have his entire
> probsoscis turned into sushi?

That scene, and the one with the zombie skining its face by stuffing it through the car windshield, were nice flourishes.


> Did conniving Lori just step out of a Melrose
> Place episode?

Would it make me racist if I said that actress/character/Lori immediately, and permanently, struck me as super-duper white trashy? I guess the "boy drama" is just an extension of her role as a fuck/save/nag female object in the story. If I recall, the comic didn't do much better by her either.


> Did Daryl just wear something with sleeves?

I think he just gained weight.


> Is the blonde girl going to turn into Sophia?

Background filler. Speaking of which, did they ever show what happened to the brother? As far as I remember, he only showed up for a few seconds in that one episode.


> Did Dale have any lines last night?

Only the romantic ones where he was trying out for the role of wife-beating maniac.


> Will Andrea continue to look forlorn and tragic in
> profile?

There is something odd and muppet-like about her expressions.


> The DEER! Whatever happened to the MOTHERF*&#%!NG
> DEER, Rick?

Hershel performed surgery on it. Rick donated his own blood. And Shane killed the fat deer in order to make a clean get-away with the salt-licks.


> Will Rick trade his Python for a gun that shoots
> more than six rounds at a time? (And why did he
> pocket the spent casings in the bar?)

I wondered about that, too. But, like Agent Gibs says, "Always police your brass."


> Will Nervous Nelly be sent to the glue factory?

Horses, under SAG guidelines, are entitled to the same throw-away death sequences as all background characters in a WD episode. And man, wasn't Horse 1's performance in the first season admirable? Maybe they'll introduce her foal near the end of the season as a "revenge-seeking" anti-horse.


> When did a Hyundai become the sexy sleek ride for
> the show's badass?

I guess Toyota didn't renew their product placement campaign...
Gcrush Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> gingaio Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I am pleased with the second-half episodes so
> > far...well, more pleased than with the
> first-half
> > ones. I have some questions.
>
> It seems to be moving at a less aggrivating pace.
>
>
> > Was the Governor driving the truck?
>
> Has he recovered from that scandel in California
> already?
>
I'm reminded of that clip I saw of Black Terminator. Why hasn't a full-length feature of that been made yet?
>
> > Did Hershel just turn into Clint Eastwood and
> save
> > the little Asian kid from some black thug (and
> > what was the name of that movie again)?
>
> It was "Driving Miss Daisy", right?
>
Possibly...
>
> > Did Hershel just pull a Shane?
>
> Maybe Shane was pulling a Hershel all along...
>
Day-um! Mind = blown!
>
>
> > Did conniving Lori just step out of a Melrose
> > Place episode?
>
> Would it make me racist if I said that
> actress/character/Lori immediately, and
> permanently, struck me as super-duper white
> trashy? I guess the "boy drama" is just an
> extension of her role as a fuck/save/nag female
> object in the story. If I recall, the comic
> didn't do much better by her either.
>
That's pretty much spot-on. One of my colleagues didn't watch the second season past the first episode because she disliked the sexist undertones involved in things such as Andrea being forbidden from carrying a gun, though I tried to explain that part of the fear was due to Andrea possibly shooting herself in the head. Andrea's not the problem, if you're a diehard feminist. If anything, Andrea is a nice counterbalance to the really primitive portrayal of Lori as what you've mentioned.

That whole episode, I found myself thinking that Shane could do a much, much better, which is really not what I think the writers want me to think.
>
> > Did Daryl just wear something with sleeves?
>
> I think he just gained weight.
>
I've been thinking of chopping all the sleeves off of my shirts, just to see what having Daryl's wardrobe would be like. Also, I would need to buy a crossbow and a Stereotypical Redneck Dictionary, complete with pronunciation guide.
>
> > Is the blonde girl going to turn into Sophia?
>
> Background filler. Speaking of which, did they
> ever show what happened to the brother? As far as
> I remember, he only showed up for a few seconds in
> that one episode.
>
There's a red Star Trek shirt waiting for the brother.
>
> > Did Dale have any lines last night?
>
> Only the romantic ones where he was trying out for
> the role of wife-beating maniac.
>
If there were domestic abuse going on, I think Dale would be on the receiving end.
>
> > Will Andrea continue to look forlorn and tragic
> in
> > profile?
>
> There is something odd and muppet-like about her
> expressions.
>
Yeah--the frequent close-ups and selected angles of framing are not flattering.
>
> > Will Rick trade his Python for a gun that
> shoots
> > more than six rounds at a time? (And why did he
> > pocket the spent casings in the bar?)
>
> I wondered about that, too. But, like Agent Gibs
> says, "Always police your brass."
>
Makes no sense, I tell you, unless he was afraid of getting tripped up by them in case he had to dash away.
>
> > Will Nervous Nelly be sent to the glue factory?
>
>
> Horses, under SAG guidelines, are entitled to the
> same throw-away death sequences as all background
> characters in a WD episode. And man, wasn't Horse
> 1's performance in the first season admirable?
> Maybe they'll introduce her foal near the end of
> the season as a "revenge-seeking" anti-horse.
>
Horsey One was indeed majestic in that episode. A corpsified horsey would be excellent.

Maybe someone can post pics in that damn Pony thread.
>
> > When did a Hyundai become the sexy sleek ride
> for
> > the show's badass?
>
> I guess Toyota didn't renew their product
> placement campaign...
>
I'm kinda excited about Subaru's BRZ. I would love to see that appear on the show, even though there's no logical reason for it to, but that's just me.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/20/2012 11:02PM by gingaio.
gingaio Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Makes no sense, I tell you, unless he was afraid
> of getting tripped up by them in case he had to
> dash away.

It was an oddly specific detail to include. Maybe the explanation got cut in editing?

As for Darryl's wardrobe, your experiment sounds like good science. I recommend you go fur it. I'll send you a copy of my pro-nun-sea-asian dick-shun-airy to help out.
And continuing the trend of British actors playing American dudes:

[blogs.amctv.com]

Not that odd given that the new Superman and Spider-Man are Brits, too.
Well, the episode introduced me to the band Wye Oak, which is nice.

For G: That Lori/Andrea argument seems to bring to light everything we dislike about Lori.

Visual symbolism was a bit on the heavy side, to say the least.

Zombie traipsing through the field was a beautiful touch, though.

One bit of puzzling logic--in all the time that the kid was under the care of Hershel, wouldn't it have come out that he knew Hershel and/or Maggie, who probably would have been helping to tend to him as well?

Also...has a Hyundai ever been used in such an action-packed manner?
First, WTF: [www.nbcnewyork.com]

That they'd been going out for nearly 4 years before this happened is astounding.

Second: As much as I like the pacing of this season, the one-black-man-on-the-show-at-a-time rule is really starting to bug me. What is this, Highlander?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2012 06:15PM by gingaio.
Sanjeev (Admin)
Eh, people in fucked situations will do fucked things. Whatever.

Yeah, the tokenism in Walking Dead is...disappointing...given how great I find the show (even if some of the drama's a bit contrived!). When they were introduced, the prisoners were MAD corny. Totally stereotypical. I dunno...stuff like that, in my mind, betrays the immaturity of the writers. Oh well...still digging the show.
They've done a pretty good job at making the token Asian guy not so token but yeah, but not developing or finding anything for T-Dogg and now Oscar to do is puzzling. Tyrese hopefully will remedy that (since he's key in the comic books) but still...
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gingaio
As much as I like the pacing of this season, the one-black-man-on-the-show-at-a-time rule is really starting to bug me. What is this, Highlander?

I was so happy that they finally killed off Lori that I almost didn't noticed the consistently low BLACK THREAT LEVEL. I guess that if they get more than two black guys in the prison at the same time the white characters will start talking about the declining quality of the neighborhood and how maybe it's time to think about relocating to an area with better school districts. Seriously though, despite the run of black background characters and zombies, it does seem odd that there's only one male lead at a time.

Personally, I can't wait until they roll out their first Asian female lead. I bet she'll be some kind of fetish dream - Japanese, super smart, super hot, uses perfect English grammar with a highly polished Engrish accent, knows how to shoot guns and karate chop zombies, but somehow still needs lots of saving and is more emotionally unbalanced than you would expect from an otherwise highly competent individual.

Ha. Who am I kidding? We'll never see an Asian woman on screen because they already gave 90% of that character to Michonne and the writers wouldn't know what else to do with one. Not that Michonne is a bad character, but that the writers might have already so thoroughly covered the Basics of Writin Wimmin Folks: domestic violence, pregnancy/abortion, nursing, cat fights, inter-racial dating, fucking "bad boys", and swinging samuari swords.
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Gcrush
I guess that if they get more than two black guys in the prison at the same time the white characters will start talking about the declining quality of the neighborhood and how maybe it's time to think about relocating to an area with better school districts.

Ha!

Quote
Gcrush
Ha. Who am I kidding? We'll never see an Asian woman on screen because they already gave 90% of that character to Michonne and the writers wouldn't know what else to do with one. Not that Michonne is a bad character, but that the writers might have already so thoroughly covered the Basics of Writin Wimmin Folks: domestic violence, pregnancy/abortion, nursing, cat fights, inter-racial dating, fucking "bad boys", and swinging samuari swords.

This is a nice observation. I hadn't thought about the view of racial interchangeability as embodied by this show (ironically, one of the writers is Asian-American). But yeah, Michonne is fulfilling the role of the Dragonlady Asian Chick, if there were to be one.

The prevailing view toward the black characters on this show seems to be that they must fulfill certain prescribed functions or not exist at all. They can't simply be human beings and whine like Carol.

Like, Michonne better be good with a sword. Oscar better be good at saving Rick's ass from the other dangerous black dude. And Tyreese, well, he has a tiny hammer. At least he was a fairly well developed character in the comic, or as well developed as a character could be in that comic (Kirkman is one very lucky pulp writer). A couple of months back I mentioned to my girlfriend that every time T-Dog came on, his one job was to point at something and saying, "What's that?" and just at the moment that I said this to her, a scene occurred in which T-Dog pointed at something and said, "What the hell?" (or something equivalent).

He became the What's-That guy, and frankly, if I became the What's-That guy, I'd want a zombie to end my misery and turn me in a Philly Cheesesteak, too.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/05/2012 11:16PM by gingaio.
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gingaio
(Kirkman is one very lucky pulp writer)

A couple of months back I mentioned to my girlfriend that every time T-Dog came on, his one job was to point at something and saying, "What's that?" and just at the moment that I said this to her, a scene occurred in which T-Dog pointed at something and said, "What the hell?"

Kirkman is proof that the good ole Edgar Rice Burroughs type of pulp is still viable in the market. I'm kind of okay with that.

As for T-Dog... I kept waiting for something to happen with that guy. But it never did. Like you said, the writers just used him as gratuitously bad grammar. Every piece of his dialog was, "!!!" Why couldn't they figure out something else to do with him?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/06/2012 03:14AM by Gcrush.
Quote
Gcrush
Quote
gingaio
(Kirkman is one very lucky pulp writer)

A couple of months back I mentioned to my girlfriend that every time T-Dog came on, his one job was to point at something and saying, "What's that?" and just at the moment that I said this to her, a scene occurred in which T-Dog pointed at something and said, "What the hell?"

Kirkman is proof that the good ole Edgar Rice Burroughs type of pulp is still viable in the market. I'm kind of okay with that.

Eh. I wasn't that keen on the comics (read through the first compendium). What I got out of it was tin-eared dialogue and shoddy characterization. Nothing remotely affecting. Seems like every choice the TV writers made (to extend the Shane storyline, to not kill Lori's baby gratuitously, to introduce the Governor as Rick's Bizarro counterpart) were all choices that gave the original story legs and the original characters substance.
My life has only one black man in it.

My life had a different black man in it in season 3 (the college years) but he didn't last much beyond that. The new black man came in during season 5 (the other college years) and has managed to last through seasons 6 and 7, though his presence has diminished.

My life does currently have two half-black lesbians in it. Does that make my life progressive or is does it feel forced because there are two?

My life has recently introduced its first major Asian male character. At least, I think so. He's Indonesian. Is that Asian? His name is Muslim, but I guess that's how they roll down there. His back story has really been fleshed out so it seems like he'll be around awhile.

My life has one Asian woman in an everyday role and one Asian woman and one half-Asian woman in supporting roles. The Asian woman in the foreground is a lesbian (but she does not carry a sword). She is very small and wears glasses though, so that's kind of a stereotype.

My life has virtually no Hispanic presence at all. Considering that the city just south of mine has the highest Puerto Rican population in the US by percentage, I think that's pretty unrealistic. My life did have one Hispanic man in a sort of teritary role for a couple months recently, but he he got drunk and wrecked his car and I haven't seen him since. He was kind of a goth and his Twitter account had references to all kinds of kinky sex stuff.

Sanjeev pops up in my life from time to time, so unless I am way off, my life has someone of Indian ancestry in it to a certain degree.

My life is completely devoid of American Indian, Eskimo, Samoan or Cape Verdean characters.

There was a transgendered person who made regular apppearances in my life for a couple of years, but my life found her incredibly annoying due to the cat ears she wore, so my life felt guilty about its feelings.

My life has some diversity in it but it could be better. My life centers around a straight, white male with a white, female significant other. My life does have more women in it than men, but the majority of characters in my life have always been white.


Thank you
cae
I watched the first three episodes and was non-plussed enough to stop. I kept waiting for the show to bring something new (or even sustainably interesting) to the concept but it didn't deliver for me. Most of the characters were either unsympathetic, unlikeable, or simple cliches - the situations as well.

I was really annoyed when the people were in the dept store, standing and waiting in front of the glass - looking at jewelry?!? - where the zombies could see them, even though there were places to wait *without* being seen. Okay, yeah, they know you're in there but, *maybe* if you weren't standing there in full sigh, antagonizing them for half a day, they might, uh, be less interested in smashing the glass to get at you? Derp.

I *did* like the part where the two fellers smeared themselves with bio-filth to walk through the zombies undetected. I always wondered about camouflage of that sort - nice to see someone play it out.

I had no problem with varying, limited degrees of zombie intelligence/dexterity as long as it decays with the passage of time.

Am bummed it didn't hook me - I do so enjoy a good zombie tale.

---------------------------------
hassenpfeffer
Sanjeev (Admin)
Diversity is important in people's lives...if not for the sake of raw survival...then for the sake of exposing oneself to a greater plurality of perspectives. That usually leads to less parochial or myopic thinking, less anti-social behavior, greater resistance to media/political/social brainwashing...better taste in food. Y'know..."nice" stuff like that. But that's all in the real world. Meatspace, as it were.

Having token "others" in common, everyday media is dangerous because it heavily reinforces the marginalization of those groups. Much easier to "other" them...to separate, and eventually dehumanize 'em. Hell, I don't know what's worse: a lack of diversity in one's life...or in the media one is exposed to...

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cae
I was really annoyed when the people were in the dept store, standing and waiting in front of the glass - looking at jewelry?!? - where the zombies could see them, even though there were places to wait *without* being seen. Okay, yeah, they know you're in there but, *maybe* if you weren't standing there in full sigh, antagonizing them for half a day, they might, uh, be less interested in smashing the glass to get at you? Derp.

Yup...that blew my mind, too. Alas, that sort of crap doesn't go away as the show progresses. There are lots of little instances where I facepalm because of dumb shit like that. Like, earlier this season where they're clearing out the prison...the group fucks up a bunch of zombies in a hallway...as the dust settles, Hershel walks RIGHT between the legs of a zombie sitting peacefully on the floor, with his back on the wall--just chilling there, not moving--and the zombie suddenly grabs him and bites his leg. C'mon. That's just contrived drama...weak story-telling.

I also thought the dialog was fucking ATROCIOUS all throughout the first season (basically, until after the CDC episodes). I don't think it was the actors' lack of ability: it was terrible scripting. Very comic book-like dialog. In a bad way. Fortunately, that *does* get better. A LOT better.

But anyway, despite that contrived drama I mentioned [oh man, all these fucking examples are pouring into my head as I type this!], I still stick with the show simply because for the first time, we actually get to see a *whole* zombie apocalypse play out...hopefully from start to finish. Movies only give us a very limited window into this sort of doomsday scenario, while this show takes the time to explore the characters' struggles and the fucked up world they live in. Like, if you dig the zombie-slop camouflage, Corey, there's lots of cool shit like that throughout the show.

Just my two cents.
cae
I'm sure there's plenty of good things that happen throughout the show as it progresses - like my first marriage wasn't *all* bad. But life is too short for me to remain married to a dumbass just because she wasn't half-bad looking and being with her allowed me to buy toys ... or to sit through a dumb show waiting for the good bits, especially when there are better shows to be watched. That's just the kind of dick I am.

:)

---------------------------------
hassenpfeffer



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/06/2012 06:35PM by cae.
Corey, I recently had some friends here on an extended stay and they wanted to check out Walking Dead, so we started watching it from the beginning. And boy, did that first season suck, in all of the ways that you're describing, especially since I was enjoying the current episodes so much. What I recommend is watch the pilot, the two episodes after that, and then the season 2 finale. Then dig into the season 3 episodes, they are worlds apart and much more enjoyable.

Regarding the current character shuffling, I noticed the Highlander thing, too, but it's a TV show and there are probably multiple reasons as to why this has been happening, not necessarily deliberate choices based on race. Who knows, the actor's schedule didn't work out, the producers weren't satisfied with the actor's performance, the actor didn't like working on the show, etc. Acting is a job at a business, just like your own job. Sometimes you quit, sometimes you get fired, it usually has nothing to do with the color of your skin, and there's probably not going to be much public discussion about it from the people involved.

If this were a comic book where the only consideration was ink and the space on the page, and two people had complete control over the characters, it would be a different story and you'd have someone to blame. Also, the current Black Man on Campus is Chad Coleman, who is an excellent actor and played one of my favorite characters on The Wire, so I'm happy with the way things are. Let's cross our fingers and hope he don't get et.

I wish Michonne would ditch the sword. We get it, Kirkman, you loved Kill Bill, and in 2004 when you introduced her it seemed like a fun thing that worked in a comic, but it didn't translate well to live action.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 12/07/2012 10:04AM by Roger.
Also, admittedly nitpicking here with the first part:

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Sanjeev
...for the first time, we actually get to see a *whole* zombie apocalypse play out...hopefully from start to finish.
Since the pilot episode is told strictly from Rick's perspective, unfortunately we miss the start of everything, which is a bummer but serves its dramatic purpose and would probably be way too expensive for TV.

As far as the "finish" goes, what is the finish? There is no cure for the zombie disease, and it doesn't look like one is ever going to come. In the comic they've showed that some of them will eventually slow down and stop walking but there are still millions of very active ones out there. And as far as the humans who are left, most of the ones who have survived are the ones who are vicious enough to prey upon each other, like the Governor and his crew.

This is what the characters are faced with, no end in sight, and with every passing day it's going to take a toll on them until they break or die. I've always felt that "The Walking Dead" refers to them, not the zombies.

How long are they going to be able to keep Baby Judith alive? Eventually they're going to run out of food for her, and if they're forced out of the prison, her crying will serve as a dinner bell for the walkers.
cae
> What I recommend is watch the pilot, the two episodes after that, and then the season 2 finale. Then dig into the season 3 episodes, they are worlds apart and much more enjoyable.

Will do - thanks for the pointer!

---------------------------------
hassenpfeffer
Sanjeev (Admin)
That's a good strategy, Roger...though I'm hesitant to dismiss that whole swath of episodes. But my memory's a sieve and I couldn't hope to cherry-pick the best/key episodes from the latter first season and second season episodes. So I guess we're left with throwing the zombie baby out with the bath water! :P

And, true, we don't *actually* see how the zombie apocalypse starts. But...do we really care? I mean, most zombie movies just sorta start with the dead rising...with no explanation. And all hell breaks loose. Sure, it woulda been neat to see the hell breaking loose, but we have seen that before many times in other productions.

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Roger
As far as the "finish" goes, what is the finish?

^^ Now this is the interesting question! We may get to see the extinction of the human race. Or we may get to see humanity get organized and kill off all the zombies...and establish some sort of feudal order. Or we may never know the true outcome of the apocalypse...but we just get to watch these main characters suffer and die.

Either way, it's more than what we're usually given in zombie movies, and I think that's the most compelling thing about this show.
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Sanjeev
That's a good strategy, Roger...though I'm hesitant to dismiss that whole swath of episodes. But my memory's a sieve and I couldn't hope to cherry-pick the best/key episodes from the latter first season and second season episodes. So I guess we're left with throwing the zombie baby out with the bath water! :P

Yup. Part of what this series affords, that's different from previous zombie movies, is the ability to exploit the genre thematically and practically in a way the short form can't. The persistent and enduring sense of loss--not just body count, but the gradual loss of different aspects of life, from the quotidian to the stereotypically 'big things'--is felt as the cumulative effect of the series.

Carl, for example. As annoying a kid as he was in the first couple of seasons, the significance of his season 3 persona is based on the viewer having seen what he was like (annoying, typical kid, stupid, interesting) leading up to the present moment.

And seeing the layers peeled away from Daryl has been one of the most unexpected and powerful--for me--aspects of the story.

Then again, I actually liked the first two seasons (though I wasn't crazy about the first half of the second), so I think I'm speaking from a different point of view than the rest of you.

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Sanjeev
And, true, we don't *actually* see how the zombie apocalypse starts. But...do we really care? I mean, most zombie movies just sorta start with the dead rising...with no explanation. And all hell breaks loose. Sure, it woulda been neat to see the hell breaking loose, but we have seen that before many times in other productions.

Before Darabont was dumped from the series, he was thinking about throwing in a bunch of one-shot episodes that would have give this series more of a varied perspective. His season 2 opener would have been devoted to the backstory of the military unit that got overrun in Atlanta (Rick meets the last member of that unit in the tank in season 1). This kind of storytelling would have called for a much larger budget than the show had been allotted, and apparently, that was one of the points of friction between Darabont and AMC.
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gingaio
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Gcrush
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gingaio
(Kirkman is one very lucky pulp writer)

A couple of months back I mentioned to my girlfriend that every time T-Dog came on, his one job was to point at something and saying, "What's that?" and just at the moment that I said this to her, a scene occurred in which T-Dog pointed at something and said, "What the hell?"

Kirkman is proof that the good ole Edgar Rice Burroughs type of pulp is still viable in the market. I'm kind of okay with that.

Eh. I wasn't that keen on the comics (read through the first compendium). What I got out of it was tin-eared dialogue and shoddy characterization. Nothing remotely affecting.

That's pretty much exactly what I mean about Burroughs. I recently read through large swaths of his Tarzan and Mars stuff. It's really hacky and easy to sport where one bit of a serial would end before the publication of the next bit. Dood was a master of contrivances and cliffhangers. I think that describes Kirkman as well.


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gingaio
Seems like every choice the TV writers made (to extend the Shane storyline, to not kill Lori's baby gratuitously, to introduce the Governor as Rick's Bizarro counterpart) were all choices that gave the original story legs and the original characters substance.

I really like what they did with the Gubnuh aside from the National Guard ambush. He would have been so much more effective a character if he weren't immediately and innately psychotic. I also like that they're making Rick less of a Mary Sue as time goes by...
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gingaio
That Lori/Andrea argument seems to bring to light everything we dislike about Lori.

I'm still so glad that Lori is out of the story. But now Andrea has become grating. The most recent Psycho Killer episode cemented this. (The episode itself was comically bad; they should have just given the Gub'nuh a hockey mask instead of dressing him like Nick Fury.) Andrea's constant tongue-wagging, eye-rolling, and Oprah-level moralizing have gotten too repetetive. At least Tyresse seems to be emerging as an interesting character.
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Gcrush
(The episode itself was comically bad; they should have just given the Gub'nuh a hockey mask instead of dressing him like Nick Fury.)

I hope he shows up in the next Avengers movie and pokes out Samuel L Jackson's other eye. They could have a fight to the last eye. God, Jackson is more grating than Andrea these days.

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Gcrush
At least Tyresse seems to be emerging as an interesting character.

Yeah, though I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. Eventually, the show producers are going to realize he's a black man and he's going to have to die if the group runs into another black man.
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gingaio
I hope he shows up in the next Avengers movie and pokes out Samuel L Jackson's other eye. They could have a fight to the last eye. God, Jackson is more grating than Andrea these days.

"I am mother-fucking sick and tired of being mother-fucking sick and tired of getting paid huge mother-fucking piles of money to play the same mother-fucker in every mother-fucking movie I'm in."

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gingaio
Yeah, though I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. Eventually, the show producers are going to realize he's a black man and he's going to have to die if the group runs into another black man.

I'm curious if the rule will apply to black wimmins, too. Or if Michonne is so fetishized that she transcends racial categories.
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Gcrush
I'm curious if the rule will apply to black wimmins, too. Or if Michonne is so fetishized that she transcends racial categories.

Michonne is Wolverine of the Walking Dead universe. You can't kill Wolverine. You can kill his beloved and strip the adamantium from his bones and give him a dorky son, and give him a crappy movie, but you can't kill Wolverine.
Sanjeev (Admin)
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Gcrush
...But now Andrea has become grating....Andrea's constant tongue-wagging, eye-rolling, and Oprah-level moralizing have gotten too repetetive.

Becoming??? I've been saying this for ages. She's been insufferable (and a downright fucking MORON) this entire season. No fault of the actress, of course--I think the writing around her character is just b-b-b-baaaad. I've been telling folks that WD is basically a soap opera...for boys...with all the hackneyed writing and predictable exploitation-plot twists.

So Andrea lets loose a bunch of zombies to try to take out Gubs...but she doesn't sneak around and try to get him from behind after he runs outta ammo (or otherwise take him out)? How about at least checking to see if he's actually dead? How about taking the truck or at least looting it for weapons? Terrible ending to this week's episode...

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Gcrush
...Michonne is so fetishized that she transcends racial categories.

^^This.

gingaio nailed it.

And I'd just like to point out that Samuel L didn't *once* say "motherfucker" or any permutation thereof in Avengers. Yes, I will continue to defend that movie as being more enjoyable than most anything Hollywood has put out in ages to my last breath! :P
This came out a while ago, and I'm sure most people have seen it, but I've been chuckling to it recently.

[www.youtube.com]

And hey, I liked the Avengers. A lot, in fact. But if someone shot Nick Fury in the face, like, fifteen times, in the sequel, I'm not exactly going to be sad. He was easily the weak link of the first movie, worse than Black Widow and Hawkeye combined. And it wasn't because of the writing, but the acting.

And that guy doesn't even have to say "motherfucker" anymore. It's implied.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/21/2013 07:17PM by gingaio.
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Sanjeev
Becoming??? I've been saying this for ages. She's been insufferable (and a downright fucking MORON) this entire season. No fault of the actress, of course--I think the writing around her character is just b-b-b-baaaad.

So Andrea lets loose a bunch of zombies to try to take out Gubs...but she doesn't sneak around and try to get him from behind after he runs outta ammo (or otherwise take him out)? How about at least checking to see if he's actually dead? How about taking the truck or at least looting it for weapons? Terrible ending to this week's episode...

I think I've noticed it because she's getting more screen. And she's just sooo fucking damsel-in-distress-because-of-her-own-obviously-bad-decisions. "Why are all my boyfriends such jerks? Men are pigs!" Anyway, it's just about time for someone from the first season to get killed off at or near the finale. I'm hoping it's her even though it won't be. (Hint: It will be Darryyll so Merryyll can take his place.)

And, yeah, that cat-and-mouse episode is definitely in the top three worst episodes of the whole series. The whole Gubnuh-Andrea sequence was like a bad fanfic, especially with the not-so-implied sexual-torture ending.
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gingaio
This came out a while ago, and I'm sure most people have seen it, but I've been chuckling to it recently.

[www.youtube.com]

And hey, I liked the Avengers. A lot, in fact. But if someone shot Nick Fury in the face, like, fifteen times, in the sequel, I'm not exactly going to be sad. He was easily the weak link of the first movie, worse than Black Widow and Hawkeye combined. And it wasn't because of the writing, but the acting.

And that guy doesn't even have to say "motherfucker" anymore. It's implied.

Loved the remix. I was singing along.

Samuel Blackson doesn't need to say mother-fuck. It's a permanent part of the atmosphere around him. Not that I blame him. I'd be doing the exact same thing if I could make millions by just phoning it in. It's the mother-fucking game, not the mother-fucking player.

For the record, I thought Avengers was super-fun despite being super-dumb.


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Sanjeev
I've been telling folks that WD is basically a soap opera...for boys...with all the hackneyed writing and predictable exploitation-plot twists.

It's true. I remember when liking zombies made me cool. Not it just makes me another housewife.
Sanjeev (Admin)
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Gcrush
...I remember when liking zombies made me cool. Not it just makes me another housewife.

Heh...don't get me wrong--I still watch the shit outta WD.

I mean, ya gotta...otherwise what're you gonna chat about with all the other fellas the next day??? :P
LOL - I recently got my GF into The Walking Dead show and she's frantically trying to get caught up in time for the Season 3 finale this Sunday.... but I can't get her to watch "Breaking Bad", "Game of Thrones" or "Mad Men" ... go figure!
My lady and I watch Walking Dead, Breaking Bad, and, lately, Homeland together. We both watch Game of Thrones, but individually, because it's too cool for us to watch it with each other.

We tried getting into Dr. Who, and I know this may be blasphemy for some here, but we just didn't get what all the fuss was about.
Sanjeev (Admin)
In classic tense hostage-exchange style, my girlfriend and I have been tentatively exposing each other to our...interests. She started with a few romantic comedies (Love and Basketball and the like), and we eventually worked our way up to--wait for it--Sex and the City. Yup. Watched the whole damn thing. Honestly, it wasn't quite as ghastly as I thought it would be (though Sarah Jessica Parker DOES look like a fucking horse).

Now it's my turn. We just watched The Vision of Escaflowne...and she loved it. We're probably gonna do Cowboy Bebop at some point...maybe Mazinkaiser or perhaps GaoGaiGar (gotta have SOME super robots in there...kinda absurd not to given the toys)...but I don't think too much more anime after that. She wants to see all the showa Godzilla films. YES.

As for tv, we both watch the Celtics and Patriots, but not much Bruins or Sox. And that's about it, really. I think Walking Dead and Doctor Who are probably the only regular current shows I watch (I've quit Game of Thrones altogether...and I just haven't had a chance to get into Breaking Bad). As for Doctor Who, the "fuss" is pretty much dead, man--sorry...you missed it. The first season (of the new show) in 2005 was meh. The second season and pretty much anything with David Tennant (the 10th Dr.) is off the hook. The latest dude ain't bad at all as an actor, but the show's writing has taken a VERY sharp nosedive. :/
Um... I would probably keep her away from "Mazinkaiser" or any Go Naga-ish stuff........ :)

For Giant Robot shows, I would go easy.... maybe Big O, Rahxephon, or at least the first half of Evangelion...
Sanjeev (Admin)
Haha...well, I was gonna skip the titty-episode of Mazinkaiser. :P We watched the Grandizer (Force Five) compilation movie...she thought it was aiight.

Big O sucked a big one. I dug the robot designs, but I'd honestly rather watch Sex and the City again than yet another "ineffable" scifi anime. Never saw Rahxephon, but I've heard it was aiight. And I definitely have considered Evangelion...'cause I actually understood/liked the original tv ending (yeah, I'm that one dude on Earth!). I'd do GaoGaiGar in a heartbeat if it weren't so long...
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Sanjeev
Now it's my turn. We just watched The Vision of Escaflowne...and she loved it. We're probably gonna do Cowboy Bebop at some point...maybe Mazinkaiser or perhaps GaoGaiGar (gotta have SOME super robots in there...kinda absurd not to given the toys)...but I don't think too much more anime after that. She wants to see all the showa Godzilla films. YES.

As for tv, we both watch the Celtics and Patriots, but not much Bruins or Sox. And that's about it, really. I think Walking Dead and Doctor Who are probably the only regular current shows I watch (I've quit Game of Thrones altogether...and I just haven't had a chance to get into Breaking Bad). As for Doctor Who, the "fuss" is pretty much dead, man--sorry...you missed it. The first season (of the new show) in 2005 was meh. The second season and pretty much anything with David Tennant (the 10th Dr.) is off the hook. The latest dude ain't bad at all as an actor, but the show's writing has taken a VERY sharp nosedive. :/

Heh. We should change the title of this thread to Shit We Can Watch with our Girlfriends.

But yeah, we started watching the first season of Dr. Who and our response was exactly 'meh.' Do we need to watch the first season to get the second one?

I actually dropped off my Samurai Champloo collection at my girlfriend's a couple of weeks ago. She liked Cowboy Bebop, and I think she'll dig this, too. I don't think she'd get the mecha stuff, though.
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