KABOOOOOOM!!! (MAXIMUM BOOM!)

Posted by Supersentai 
Hey kids, check this out!

[www.bigbadtoystore.com]

Indexed for nearly twenty-five year's inflation, that's not an awful price.
Is there an actual Takara announcement somewhere?

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
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Supersentai
Hey kids, check this out!

[www.bigbadtoystore.com]

Indexed for nearly twenty-five year's inflation, that's not an awful price.

Damn right, that price is real good, especially considering the current exchange rate...

They have a more expensive option ($50 more to get one a month earlier). I placed an order for that one. They quoted me an estimate of roughly $21 for UPS Ground shipping to me (East Coast).

It is supposed to be in the Japanese box with the Master Sword and all accessories, and rumor is that E-Hobby is doing a Grand Max recolor...place your orders kids, before the scalpers get them and before they start selling the parts as originals on ebay...hopefully they will update the stampings and put additional ones on several areas of the toy.

I'm really just excited that I get to peel this thing out of the box and put all the stickers on!!!!

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
I TREMBLE. Also I feel a lot better about skipping the $350 Brave Maximus I saw at the two show a month or two ago.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
I put a pre-order down on one of these myself. Dunno how I'm going to pay for it, but I'm going to one way or the other.

More serious than thou
oh....so....tempting....someone for the love of God please talk me out of buying this....
Sword...dude...sword...which, if I'm not exaggerating, usually goes for like $350.00 by itself...so you decide...and don't screw this up!

No presssssssssure...
Info from BBTS via email tonight says that the price went down to $329 too.

More serious than thou
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fujikuro
Info from BBTS via email tonight says that the price went down to $329 too.

I just got the email as well, BBTS's pricing dropped, it's now $379.99 for early delivery and $329.99 for second batch as fujikuro stated.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
Sanjeev (Admin)
You assholes're making hard to resist! ;)
It took some tough decisions on the whole "stuff I have already preordered front" but I caved...He will be mine...

Damn you Supersentai for pointing out that about the sword.....Come on Sanjeev all the coolkids are doing it....
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Sanjeev
You assholes're making hard to resist! ;)

As if I wasn't throwing enough fuel on the fire, and since no one mentioned it, the release date has been pushed up as well. It is now Feb/Mar (1st Batch/2nd Batch) instead of Mar/April...so yeah I am getting mine in February!!!!

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
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fel9
.....Come on Sanjeev all the coolkids are doing it....

Yeah, what he said, LoL...you know that theme song is running through your head right now...it's on constant repeat in mine, along with the images of the series opening...

Head On! Head On! Head On!

Omae to tsukuro tatakai no nai mirai
Ai suru mono ni noko so utsukushii ucho

Kaware! Headmaster
Tatakae! Headmaster
Kono itami ima no kurushimi
Sore ga dareka wo shiawase ni suru no sa
Transformer Transformer
Headmaster

EDIT: Oh man, I had to remove the "o"s with the japanese punctuation for syllables and grammar on them...Phorum had a conflict with 'em and I got a "you can't post that ish" message all in computer code LoL...

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/05/2012 11:15AM by Mr. Ginrai.
So did anyone else decide to order this?

Were we not able to crack Sanjeev's will and get him to order one? LoL

I still haven't heard anything on a shipping update, as it's too early for one even on my "early air" preorder. I am eagerly awaiting this one though. Might have to take a day out of work for the first time ever. Praying it comes on a Friday so I get a whole weekend to blow putting the stickers on and just staring at it.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
Sanjeev (Admin)
Heh...I'm sure others ordered this fella (Jeremy? Ben?)...but my will stands unshaken! ;)

Okay--maybe a little shaken! :P If they happen to release this guy (WITH all the accessories) in Brave Maximus colors, I'd be sorely tempted. Always loved that look! Those shades of red and blue (much like Powered Convoy) just scream "DIACLONE" to me.

But honestly, as soon as they announced the new twenty-four inch FoC Metroplex, most of my desire for ol' shrimpy Fort Max dwindled!



Granted, he could use an aftermarket head upgrade...but for $125...and a couple inches taller? Tough to beat that!
How much was the BBTS shipping quote? Tempted to get this from tfsource for the free shipping...
It was just about $20 or $21 from them to me on the east coast (new England area).

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
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Sanjeev
If they happen to release this guy (WITH all the accessories) in Brave Maximus colors, I'd be sorely tempted.

I don't mean to root against you, but I'm hoping for the profit-maximizing recolor to be Grand Maximus. I got a good deal on a mostly complete Fort Max in Kentucky 10 years ago and I ordered Brave Max when it came out, so a re-release of Grand Max would allow me to complete the trinity of gigantism on the cheap(er).

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Sanjeev
But honestly, as soon as they announced the new twenty-four inch FoC Metroplex, most of my desire for ol' shrimpy Fort Max dwindled!

I am very excited about the huge Metroplex. It always seemed like he was meant to be the real king of bigness. From the looks of him though, he might have a hard time handling Fort Max in a fight. He may be taller (which is up for debate) but he's also a bit skinnier.

On the idea of recoloring enormous TFs, please make a note in your records that I do not have any interest in a Metrotitan version. That color scheme does nothing for me.

Thank you
Sanjeev (Admin)
Oh, I'm ALL for a Grand Maximus recolor, too. I mean, why not, right??? They have the molds...it'd be like printing money for them! I just don't have any of these guys (and don't have a huge connection to the G1 character)...and I happen to dig the Brave Max colors the best.

As for the FoC Metroplex (that looks *nothing* like he does in FoC!), he's definitely skinnier than FM. But he's also a third the price. LOL

I'm not a huge fan of the Metrotitan color scheme--especially with those red hands--but it's at least something different, y'know? The all-white with black and red accents scheme on Metroplex is kinda boring. But with Diaclone-esque red and blue being the main colors on Metrotitan...I'm in.
I definitely preordered the reissue Fort Max and I would also love a reissue Grand and hell, I still think Brave Max has the best colors just as you say, Sanjeev! I also totally want this new huge Metroplex, but it's totally not supposed to FoC Metroplex. It's a revamp of G1 apparently inspired by IDW comics, not Fall of Cybertron.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
Sanjeev (Admin)
Oh, weird...I thought the new Metroplex was gonna be marketed as an FoC toy. But going back to the Toy Fair coverage, I guess there's no mention of the game on the box. Oh well.

Back to Fort Max!
Well the game has been out for some time now, so it'd be a little late for a tie-in, I think.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
For everyone who is still waiting on theirs like I am, here are some updates (supposedly out of figure-oh magazine recently and reported at TFW2005).

1. Styrofoam insert!!!!
2. Master sword decals are tampo'd to allow access to the screw for disassembly to store in the box (original version would have required a cut or hole punched in the sticker, or risked sticker damage if trying to remove it).
3. Painted eyes for fort max head. So no messing up that sticker that never really fit well anyways.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
Thank god on the painted eyes.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
Sanjeev (Admin)
Haha...that bad, huh? One of my buddies in college had one(!), but that was my only exposure ever to the toy.

By the way, I'm just now appreciating how good this thread title is. :P
I think the sticker was hit or miss. If you put it on right, it sometimes still looked like crap on ones I have seen. It fell off others, some people just didn't put it on.

It is a good move though because it will be easy to tell that the painted eyes ID an encore piece. We'll see what other tweaks they make to cut the potential secondary market fraud for people who think they are gonna part them out and pass these off as mint vintage...

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
Sanjeev (Admin)
Sort of a related thing, Mike...I just wonder what the release of the Encore toy will do to secondary market prices for the vintage toy in general...

I mean, I'm *all* for having tiny changes/tweaks to show that the repro is different from the vintage, but I'm just curious if vintage prices will become fucked either way.
Well, I can touch on that quickly, and I'll include my thoughts on why I bought one of these even though I really only buy vintage.

I have two reissue transformers in my entire collection - one of them is the Japanese C-310 Super God Ginrai set, it was just too good not to get and at that point I was too afraid to just buy an original Japanese one.

I will still buy a vintage American boxed Fort Max at some point, if condition and price is right, because I WOULD like an original. If they do E-Hobby Grand, I'll buy. I don't have Brave and wouldn't buy an Encore Brave, even if it came with the previously excluded parts. So why buy the encore? Simple, good price, brand new, and I get to put it together from new my self, stickers and all hopefully. Not gonna do that with vintage because you are limited to what you will find. Sure I could reprolabel, but that's more cost and not really my thing. On top of that, I don't have to pick up a KO Master Sword separately, and it's the full blown Japanese Headmasters box, so it goes well with all the Japanese vintage floating around on my shelves.

As far as the market, it will be interesting. I know of people who just dropped insane coin before the reissue announcement came out (like 3G's plus) on vintage ones, which in my opinion was a stupid move even if the reissue wasn't going to happen. That's just people being impatient. Unfortunately, those people want to slit their wrists right now.

I think it won't be affected too much, at least not at first. A buddy of mine says he has been tracking prices (he recently bought a mint loose vintage for a steal, and has an encore on order also) and hasn't noticed too much of a change in prices. I don't think vintage will nosedive, because vintage Fort Max is expensive for the wrong reasons, and people will never be smart enough to realize that.

The question I have is whether or not this will be a bust in general - so many people have been clamoring for this, but I don't see many people ordering - too many are bitching about price. It is expensive, but way less than it could have been. I had said years ago I would have gone like $600 for one of these, and the fact that it's under four hundred imported in a shit economy is insane. The fans have been given a gift so they don't have to look towards the vintage KOs, so they should suck it up while they can. That said, it will be interesting to see how many people think they are going to scalp these encores on ebay after supply runs out.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/16/2013 02:10PM by Mr. Ginrai.
I don't think it'll be a bust... the one factor that I've seen that has seemed to influence people is the new Metroplex coming out at a fraction of the price. But I would think that they would've learned not to overproduce, since it seemed like the Car Robots version sat a bit. And at least in my case, the 3rd party insane pricing has made this seem more reasonable.

If I were a vintage-only collector, what I'd be afraid of is not that people would try to pass off the main body of this thing as a vintage, but that people would use this to replace missing accessories and make vintage ones "complete." That would be harder to track, unless they used a slightly different color of plastic or had some kind of imprinting on it.
Sanjeev (Admin)
I hear ya, Mike.

Well, if vintage prices don't tank, those people who just bought before the Encore announcement shouldn't be slitting their wrists...they should just reBay 'em...

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Mr. Ginrai
I don't think vintage will nosedive, because vintage Fort Max is expensive for the wrong reasons, and people will never be smart enough to realize that.

What are these "wrong reasons"?

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fujishig
If I were a vintage-only collector, what I'd be afraid of is not that people would try to pass off the main body of this thing as a vintage, but that people would use this to replace missing accessories and make vintage ones "complete." That would be harder to track, unless they used a slightly different color of plastic or had some kind of imprinting on it.

^^Exactly. That's what I meant before--I hope *every* component gets a tiny tweak or at least a year embossed on some inconspicuous spot.

But yeah, I don't think the Encore will be a bust. There's a lot of buzz about it...and ALL you ever hear online is the negative stuff. I'm sure these won't warm shelves like the Encore Omega Supreme's. There's just too much interest in the original toy.

As for whether the announcement of neo-Metroplex will turn some folks off to the Encore FM, that's a good question. I tend to doubt it...but then again, I was on the fence about FM before...and now, I'm firmly in favor of *just* picking up Metroplex. So maybe they DID cannibalize their own sales a bit. They probably shoulda delayed neo-Metroplex for a year or so to maximize FM sales. Fortress Maximize. Yeah.
For what it's worth God Ginrai (it's not Super God Ginrai, just God Ginrai or Super Ginrai if you don't get the set with Godbomber) does have differences between the original and the reissue, but you really have to know what you are looking for, other than the blue eyes on the smaller robot. Most obvious difference aside from the eyes is the paint on the cab is more orangey on the reissue and it's redder on the original. There are other minor differences. (I once wrote a pretty detailed article with pics on my old site, Masterforce.org.)

Fortress Maximus prices may not be dropping, but Brave Maximus ones sure have been. I think people are ditching that one (with its "wrong" colors) for the newer reissue.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
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Sanjeev
I hear ya, Mike.

Well, if vintage prices don't tank, those people who just bought before the Encore announcement shouldn't be slitting their wrists...they should just reBay 'em...

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Mr. Ginrai
I don't think vintage will nosedive, because vintage Fort Max is expensive for the wrong reasons, and people will never be smart enough to realize that.

What are these "wrong reasons"?

But yeah, I don't think the Encore will be a bust. There's a lot of buzz about it...and ALL you ever hear online is the negative stuff. I'm sure these won't warm shelves like the Encore Omega Supreme's. There's just too much interest in the original toy.

I don't think vintage will bust because someone (like me) will always want vintage. But I am getting this one to have a FM from new, which is near impossible.

The people that are in the 3k+ club should just re-bay them, but I think it will be at a loss, a sever one. That was a little much. I mean, let's talk seriously about it for a second. If you have a mint US boxed FM, complete, white, etc. regardless of stickers applied or unapplied or not, dropping 3k+ for one whether the reissue was gonna happen or not is nuts - and I know a toy is only worth what someone is willing to pay but this is really pushing it. 3k for that toy is pushing prices for flawless Japanese releases with original Master Swords, and pushing god condition boxed Grand Max prices. Worldwide, the US release just isn't that rare. It's abundant in most cases. And I'm not even going to touch graded ones because they are few and far between, and I just don't care for AFA anything.

As far as wrong reasons for FM being expensive:

Fort Max is an odd duck. Do I think he is overpriced? Yes. Should he be $400-1000 for a complete loose one depending on how good a deal you get? Yes. Should a boxed one in the same shape be $1000-1200 or $1500? Yes. But 2k, 3k+ for a US release, come on. So as you can see, I agree there will be lows and highs, and a few give aways, but there are much rarer toys (both transformers and other vintage toys) that that have huge price disparity - both lower and higher than FM.

If you come from the transformers side of collecting like I do, you will understand that there has been a lot of uneasiness in the market since the Michael Bay era brought a lot of "new collectors" in. So prices have gone cyclical in response to film releases, among other things.

The other constant problem with TF, especially G1, is that some characters get what I will call "fan hype overrides", either based on the character themselves being popular, or the toy being popular. Some examples here are G1 Skywarp (people like skywarp because he is a seeker, in starscream's (huge fan favorite) shadow, and his toy therefore is a big deal, even though he has always been a bit of a sleeper. Shockwave, aside from being a good character, only has one toy, a good one is a tough find and it is a kick ass toy at that. So those two are must haves, but skywarps demand is a bit more artificial. He has cycled so ridiculously in the past because of it.

I'll go out on a limb and say that most toy people and "regular" and "new" TF collectors see FM as the holy grail of TF even though he is just not that rare. Like they may have a shit collection (or not) and see FM as their gateway to being looked at as "hardcore" or even on simpler terms "legitimate/justified". But how does FM make the guy with an unbroken skyhammer or a boxed macross version not as qualified? At the end of the day it's what makes you happy, but I'm not in this to be one of those "look at me" collectors either. Really, it gets like that - some of the TF people we have come across are straight crazy.

My issue (and I don't have an FM remember), is that getting a Fort Max isn't really a big deal. We can go on ebay EVERY day, EVERY day and plenty of FM come up - common or rare parts, loose, boxed, complete etc. He is readily available all you have to do is Buy. No hunting and searching, no hoping. Just wait for a good one and bam you can have it. Even before ebay, I could have gotten one, multiple times. When I was a kid they were around secondhand and still $100-200 in the box. Toy show, wherever, you name it. I didn't buy one because I had better things to get at the time, and he was/is always around. And for the one toy that I never picked up at steal prices years ago, I don't regret not getting it. Because I can just get one whenever, and when I feel like it I'll cop a vintage one in addition to the encore I will have.

Fort Max also gets hype because he is big ass toy. We are all aware of this. That's the american mentality - oh this is big so it must be worth a lot. How many times have you gone to a toy show or flea market and anything that is a large item has an inflated or insane price because it is big? But he is expensive because he has three or four parts that are a bitch to find if you lose or don't have them (spike and cerebros and their guns). Not 'cause he is big. And it doesn't help that when he gets parted out, dealers pull off every nook and cranny part, even the stuff that most people didn't loose as as kid. I never see japanese version FM stuff getting parted out to the extent that american ones do, maybe I am missing something? I think most people would easily have good FMs with anywhere between 0 and 2 repro parts total if the damn things didn't get stripped the way they do.

So when you break it down:
No character hype because he was in three US episodes and the only people that pay attention to his "character" are those who cared to look at or are fans of the Headmasters show from Japan.
Toy hype because it is his only toy for America.
Size hype because he is big.
Rarity hype when he really isn't rare.
Holy Grail hype because of a combination of the above reasons, when he is far from a true grail.
Basically just a lot of what I feel is artificial influence, and I think I am fairly correct.

And again, this is a toy that I will buy, and will pay large money for if I have to - but the point we have seen sales hit for this are jsut way too erratic and uncalled for. There's the market, and then there are the "anomalies" and the "stupidity" sales thrown in the mix.

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Ginrai
For what it's worth God Ginrai (it's not Super God Ginrai, just God Ginrai or Super Ginrai if you don't get the set with Godbomber) does have differences between the original and the reissue, but you really have to know what you are looking for, other than the blue eyes on the smaller robot. Most obvious difference aside from the eyes is the paint on the cab is more orangey on the reissue and it's redder on the original. There are other minor differences. (I once wrote a pretty detailed article with pics on my old site, Masterforce.org.)

Fortress Maximus prices may not be dropping, but Brave Maximus ones sure have been. I think people are ditching that one (with its "wrong" colors) for the newer reissue.

Actually that is my stupid error and what I get for trying to rush a quick post on my lunch break. I DID buy the C-310 set with Godbomber, hence my comment about not being able to pass it up and referencing the added "Super" in the title (prior post edited to correct reference number). Anyways, I purchased that reissue because I was in a similar situation with US Powermaster Prime, as I was with this Fort Max. I wanted a vintage to upgrade my loose one I got second hand as a child (so it wasn't really mine), but as common as PM Prime was I couldn't find a good one cheap enough. Then that reissue came out, and I said "wow, that's perfect" and I liked it better than the TRU re-release as well. Funny thing is, I finally ended up getting my replacement vintage G1 PM Prime (equivalent of the C-307) and it was MIB unused for a steal in 2010. So now I have had both for a while and couldn't be happier.

It's funny you bring up brave max, my friend and several other collectors have constantly spoke of BM being the best of the three as far as colorways go, especially with the city details added. I don't agree. I think from best to worst its FM, BM, GM.

I do think BM gets a bum wrap because he doesn't come with the extra pieces (contest exclusive) and that is especially souring people now that FM and possibly grand (and let's say possibly another Brave, but complete one) are coming out. In addition, I felt that many non Car Robots fans that bought Brave, bought him because the price point was that much better at the time of his release compared to vintage FM and it was the same as this encore situation - a "brand new" toy for the buyer. Then in the last few years his prices hit some stupid high numbers (went from 3-400 boxed to 700 boxed all of a sudden, consitently) and I think it was the hype of the many previous Encore and KO Fort Max announcements that proved to be fake and people got tired of waiting, so they bought BM and ended up paying for it.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
Ok so rumors are circulating that there are various QC issues with Fort Max going around - they are not all experienced by one person - some people have one or two mainly, some have a couple. Started getting mentioned on SGCollect and then made its way over to TFW:

So the current list of known issues with the Fortress Maximus reissue includes:


0. Red guns on left hand are improperly installed so that they face backwards (fixable: unscrew the hand assembly, flip the gun and reassemble).

1. Cerebros has very tight leg joints (fixable: loosen the screw and/or shave off some plastic).

2. Cog has 2 left arms.

3. The holes to plug in Gasket's guns are susceptible to stress marks.

4. Fort Max's left hand doesn't have the extra circular holder in the fist to hold his weapons.

5. Bottom of Spike's feet has mould flash, making him unstable (fixable: shave off the excess flash).

6. Fort Max has a defective left hip ratchet.

7. Cannon on left leg is loose and is prone to popping out easily.

8. Spike is missing his arms.

9. Missing one or more weapons.

10. Smudged blue paint on the central die-cast panel.

11. Loose knee joints on Spike.



Some people are hoping the late delivery ones fare better, some are repoting no problems at all.

Others also said that the accessory bags are not sealed well so you need to look around in the foam and box for tiny parts like cog's gun. Check out the pics getting put up on TFW in the images of Fort Max thread to see some examples: [www.tfw2005.com]

HLJ is sold out for those that weren't aware. I took the early BBTS route so at least I have an option for a return if mine is crap. My shipping was a flat $19.99 so it was 399.98 for my Max shipped. I also got the shippin notice from BBTS yesterday, my Max is sceduled to arrive Monday April 8th. I will report back once I crack him open.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
I briefly entertained the option of ordering it from amiami when it went back in stock, but I can't imagine what the shipping is...
Just got home and cracked mine open. I have NO ISSUES AT ALL. MINE IS PERFECT.

- Mike


Deep in the Hasbro Jungle
I got my Encore Fortress Maximus last night. YAYYY! However, he has some problems. Spike's thighs are incorrectly assembled (they are backwards.) They are supposed to be like this:



This makes it so Spike does not properly transform into the smaller head.

There is also a red double-barreled gun that hides inside of the left hand of the large Fortress Maximus robot. One of the clips that holds the double-barreled gun is either incorrectly shaped or damaged so the gun falls out instead of staying in place.

I've already sent BBTS customer service an email about. It seems to me the issue with Spike's thighs is just factory assembly line negligence, but the messed up clip for the gun is weird. It almost seems like a lot of the plastic is slightly too soft.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
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So my original Encore Fortress Maximus was pretty screwed up. So badly that BBTS made me send it back. They sent a replacement. It is even worse. First of all, the Spike figure has the same problems with the misassembled legs, plus the arms are kind of misaligned. The gun cover on one of the arms is badly stressed and looks like it will break soon. The gray door on the chest is cut wrong and does not line up correctly. There's also a huge gouge on the side of one of the large Fortress Maximus robot's legs.

Takara Tomy really screwed the pooch here.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/31/2013 03:26PM by Ginrai.
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Sanjeev (Admin)
Damn...

Not good.
Good my refund. Good on BBTS for accepting the defective product back, paying for shipping, and refunding me my money. Go BBTS! I'm looking for a Brave Maximus now.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
Okay! I won a Brave Max for less than Encore Fort Max cost on eBay. eBay best offer is a super rad tool I really like now. I got Encore parts for the bits that Brave Max doesn't have (two large guns, Cog and his gun), now I just need to get a sword and I will be good to go.

-Ginrai
Golden Gate Riot on dead trees at: [www.destroyallcomics.com]
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