Masterpiece Starscream...again

Posted by VF5SS 



YamaBandaTakaTomy-toe'd



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/20/2011 04:29PM by VF5SS.
Attachments:
open | download - newmpstarscream.jpg (127.1 KB)
They're saying the price is 13,000 Yen

Well I guess people paid like $30 for those aftermarket coronation sets :v
B00
A re-tool? That's disappointing. I was hoping it would be an all new mold. It has been un-Kawamoried but so have the Igear figures. I'll stick with those (igear's).

__________________
MoonBaseTom Season tickets available. Call now.
Kawamori did more than just the hip things :/



these Jetcons have nothing on their legs

omg MP is worthless
I wonder how much of the final version of this product will be based on iGear's mods. I've been wondering for a while when HasTak was going to start knocking off the third-party stuff, when it would begin releasing more refined, spiffed-up versions of Fansproject's and iGear's toys. An offical G1-altered version of FP's Defender would be amazing, and it would be high-larious to see ideas being stolen the other way.

As for this seeker, even with the mods, it still ain't nearly as Showy as the CHUG version. Still, though...
wait you're just trolling right

because none of that makes any sense

If anything this is just them resetting the design to be more like the prototype



like that

but whatever be like those Macrossworld guys

who think this means they're going to make a Masterpiece Galvatron because of this

ps CHUG and HasTak are lame words
As for the original prototype, it's just odd that HasTak's chosen now to suddenly do the fix back, in light of iGear's news. Could mean something or absolutely nothing. I was actually kidding about HasTak "ripping off" iGear.

As for the reference to Macrossworld nerdity, as I don't read that board regularly, I don't get it.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2011 12:09AM by gingaio.
gingaio Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But man, you are seriously an unpleasant dude. You
> must be quite the well-adjusted social giant in
> real life. Kudos.


hell yeah mang

i stride around walking my cut widdle puppy (ask Paul) and when she's breaking the ice, I make my moves

lighting up my Facebook like a Christmas tree
I would buy one if they made painted it Burple and Plack.


VF5SS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> i stride around walking my cut widdle puppy (ask
> Paul) and when she's breaking the ice, I make my
> moves

You subcontract the peacocking and ice-breaking out to a dog?
Check out the ugly ball-jointed shaft that connects the null rays to the arms. I see it in the old prototype pics, too so its something that was dropped (fortunately) for the original release of MP Starscream. Its interesting that Takara is just releasing the old prototype but I'm sure its saving them money.






Old prototype:



--------------------------
I want YOU for Moé Sucks Army



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/21/2011 11:35AM by Scopedog.
Attachments:
open | download - MP11-Masterpiece-Coronation-Starscream-01_1319166714.jpg (341.2 KB)
open | download - MP11-Masterpiece-Coronation-Starscream-02_1319166714.jpg (333.1 KB)
open | download - MP11-Masterpiece-Coronation-Starscream-03_1319166714.jpg (362.4 KB)
open | download - MP11-Masterpiece-Coronation-Starscream-04_1319166714.jpg (256.5 KB)
fantofan proto

--------------------------
I want YOU for Moé Sucks Army
Attachments:
open | download - fk100-3.jpg (108.6 KB)
gingaio Wrote:
>
> As for this seeker, even with the mods, it still
> ain't nearly as Showy as the CHUG version. Still,
> though...

Well, I wouldn't expect that for a couple of reasons.

First of all, the Masterpiece line loves its high level of detail, and that's going to always detract in a thousand tiny ways from the smooth-surfaced, round-cornered look of the animation models. The Classics molds have a fair amount of detail, but particularly because of their size they always visually read more as a series of basic colored shapes. On a toy the size of a Masterpiece, it's easier to see the figure as a series of flat expanses and facets which are themselves covered with engraved and raised detail, which dispels much of the "look" of the animation models that the Classics figures retain.

And on top of that, MP Starscream in particular is designed around a fairly realistic jet mode. The limitations on the robot design created by the shapes of the F-15 surely impact just how "showy" the robot can ever look.


P.S. I had to ask VF5SS what CHUG means. You damn Transfans and your Translingo.


VF5SS Wrote:
>
> hell yeah mang
>
> i stride around walking my cut widdle puppy (ask
> Paul) and when she's breaking the ice, I make my
> moves
>
> lighting up my Facebook like a Christmas tree

You should all be adding Veef on Facebook and looking at videos of his doggies.

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
Gcrush Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> You subcontract the peacocking and ice-breaking
> out to a dog?

chicks dig dogs



also i feel the need to brighten people's days through puppy therapy

like my mother asked me to bring my puppy to where she works

one of her co-workers was having a really bad week so the visit of a friendly puppy drove her to tears of joy


^3^
I dig it.
I think that the MP-11 is EXACTLY what I was preaching on a previous post about how I think Takara/Hasbro is watching what the secondary market is doing and is just doing it themselves. People kept complaining about the leg kibble and changing it and they took a page out of IGear. I like my Original Hasbro Starscream better (especially since I did the leg modification) with the darker colors and weathering panel lines. I know the cartoon didn't have it but I like the crown decal on the original Masterpiece too. It just seems like something Starscream would do. in my opinion. Also I'm not feling the plastic cape. The cloth one just looks better and more expensive.

What would be a true kick in the nuts is if Takara bootlegged Just Bee with the coneheads and just stole the market from them. that way someone did the the additional engineering and marketing and I'm sure everyone would take the licensed version by Takara over the IGEAR even if if weren't for IGear they wouldn't have been created. funny thing there would be NOTHING IGear could do about it.
Sanjeev (Admin)
VF5SS Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> chicks dig dogs
>
>
>
> also i feel the need to brighten people's days
> through puppy therapy
>
> like my mother asked me to bring my puppy to where
> she works
>
> one of her co-workers was having a really bad week
> so the visit of a friendly puppy drove her to
> tears of joy
>
>
> ^3^


They're still not sentient.

Just saying.

;)
Sanjeev (Admin)
Marvin Lee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...Also I'm not feling the plastic cape.

Oh, I was gonna mention that. I mean, it's clever how they jointed the thing, but I fucking hate molded plastic capes on toys. Actual fabric with a bendy wire lining is ideal.
The neck still sits too high. Of all the things to tweek, THAT would have been my first target... just make the canopy section sit a hair lower, so the top portion is flush with the chest intakes. The way the neck is now always make the head look like it is a bust on a raised pedestal. I own multiple Seekers and enjoy them, but that always bugged me more than Kawamori's leg tweaks.

Introducing Prometheus Rising Studio.
[prometheusrising.net]
I make 3D printed mecha action figures.
Sanjeev (Admin)
Holy shit--I hadn't noticed that before. And, of course, now I can't unsee it. Yeah, that's REALLY off.
Sanjeev Wrote:
> Holy shit--I hadn't noticed that before.
> And, of course, now I can't unsee it.

Oh DAMMIT I just had exactly the same reaction too.

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
Sanjeev Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> VF5SS Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > chicks dig dogs
> >
> >
> >
> > also i feel the need to brighten people's days
> > through puppy therapy
> >
> > like my mother asked me to bring my puppy to
> where
> > she works
> >
> > one of her co-workers was having a really bad
> week
> > so the visit of a friendly puppy drove her to
> > tears of joy
> >
> >
> > ^3^
>
>
> They're still not sentient.
>
> Just saying.
>
> ;)


Dogs are definitely sentient (feeling); they'd be useless to us if they weren't. They may or may not be sapient (thinking), but the same evidence that suggests we are sapient also suggests they are, too.

Just saying. :)

Best, Ken-A
asterphage Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>First of all, the Masterpiece line loves its high level of detail, and that's
>going to always detract in a thousand tiny ways from the smooth-surfaced,
>round-cornered look of the animation models. The Classics molds have a fair
>amount of detail, but particularly because of their size they always visually
>read more as a series of basic colored shapes. On a toy the size of a
>Masterpiece, it's easier to see the figure as a series of flat expanses and
>facets which are themselves covered with engraved and raised detail, which
>dispels much of the "look" of the animation models that the Classics figures
>retain.

As far as the "texturing" of the MPs, yeah, that's true, though something like the MP Grimlock seems to have successfully combined the simplicity of the animation models/G1 toys with the modern aesthetic. It is possible to create MPs with that old-school charm.

Even the MP-10, which is busy (but in a cool, Studio-Ox-styled way) retains, in its basic bodily silhouette (no more weightlifter proportions a la the MP-01, for one thing), enough shades of the G1 toy to keep me happy.

>And on top of that, MP Starscream in particular is designed around a fairly
>realistic jet mode. The limitations on the robot design created by the shapes
>of the F-15 surely impact just how "showy" the robot can ever look.


The 1st version MP seekers have definitely been stylized a certain way. Not crazy about them, but I'm game for this revision. Am selling off my extra Henkei Starscream to make way for it, in fact.


asterphage wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sanjeev Wrote:
> > Holy shit--I hadn't noticed that before.
> > And, of course, now I can't unsee it.
>
> Oh DAMMIT I just had exactly the same reaction
> too.
>
Yeah, that's the one big visual failure of this toy. Not enough to keep me from actually buying it, but it's an eyesore for sure.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/2011 11:44PM by gingaio.
Sailor Moon,

The cap looks like something I'd see on a collectors model of sailor moon or animation of that ilk. Maybe if it were darker? Like Sanjeev said. real cloth with a wire works best. That part has been over engineered.

It reminds me of when the government spent thousands of dollars trying to design a pen that would write in space (pens back then needed gravity to work and didn't use a paste gell type of ink) anyway after spending all that money they came up short. The Russians who didn't have as much resources (funds) just used a pencil.

Moral--Sometimes you gotta to watch thee eggheads- Thurstin Howell III
gingaio Wrote:
>
> As far as the "texturing" of the MPs, yeah, that's
> true, though something like the MP Grimlock seems
> to have successfully combined the simplicity of
> the animation models/G1 toys with the modern
> aesthetic. It is possible to create MPs with that
> old-school charm.

Ahh, I actually meant to mention that. Grimlock is something of an exception - I think he looks so natural in MP form because we associate him with the highly-detailed G1 toy. The proportions of MP Grimlock's dino mode are spot-on, but his robot mode doesn't really look that much like the cartoon model.

As for the old-school charm, I feel like the various Masterpiece Optimuses owe their charm less to a resemblance to the G1 toy or character model and more to that very use of detail - the way mechanical features and detail are distributed makes it feel like Optimus is structured the way a Transformer "should" be. It's more of a "You will believe the old-school Optimus design can turn into a realistic truck" than it is a perfect realization of the cartoon's character design.

Really, I think Rodimus is the only MP that captures the cartoon look at all. The others seem to be striving to be mechanically believable above all else.

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
asterphage Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ahh, I actually meant to mention that. Grimlock is
> something of an exception - I think he looks so
> natural in MP form because we associate him with
> the highly-detailed G1 toy. The proportions of MP
> Grimlock's dino mode are spot-on, but his robot
> mode doesn't really look that much like the
> cartoon model.
>
> As for the old-school charm, I feel like the
> various Masterpiece Optimuses owe their charm less
> to a resemblance to the G1 toy or character model
> and more to that very use of detail - the way
> mechanical features and detail are distributed
> makes it feel like Optimus is structured the way a
> Transformer "should" be. It's more of a "You will
> believe the old-school Optimus design can turn
> into a realistic truck" than it is a perfect
> realization of the cartoon's character design.

>
An interesting point, though I would add that that was also the
raison d'etre of the Diaclone/Microchange toys on which the '84/'85 TF line was based. Those old cars and cameras and guns were meant to be very realistic as well. (It wasn't until the movie line, '86 and beyond, that the TFs favored the robot modes over the vehicle ones.) That's why, for me, the MP Grimlock and MP-10, which are more toy accurate than show accurate, have that early G1 charm.

In any case, showiness for me was never an absolute term. I think it's obvious to most people that something that's 100% showy isn't going to look good (simple, brightly colored polygons stuck together, essentially), just as some saucer-eyed anime character is not going to look good in three dimensions unless it's modified.

It was more an issue of whether the modern toy can take the operating principle of the early G1 toys, which you've described above, and develop it even further to incorporate the 'toon designs as well.
gingaio Wrote:
>
> An interesting point, though I would add that that
> was also the raison d'etre of the Diaclone/Microchange
> toys on which the '84/'85 TF line was based.

> That's why, for me, the MP Grimlock and MP-10, which
> are more toy accurate than show accurate, have that
> early G1 charm.

> In any case, showiness for me was never an
> absolute term. I think it's obvious to most people
> that something that's 100% showy isn't going to
> look good (simple, brightly colored polygons stuck
> together, essentially), just as some saucer-eyed
> anime character is not going to look good in three
> dimensions unless it's modified.

Ah, okay. When you say "show-y", I think of something like the MP Rodimus, or JizaiToys' products, or the Transformers:Animated toyline, which really do aim for fidelity to the animation models. For the most part, though, I think the best TFs designed in this way look great - they really do look like a three-dimensional cartoon standing there.

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
When Jizai first came out with its stuff, I was totally onboard with it, too. I think, though, once the Henkei Cyclonus came out and I compared it to Jizai's, my views on absolute Showiness softened a bit.

That said, the new "chogokin" Wheelie (blatantly ripped off from Jizai) looks fantastic, as does Jizai's Powerglide (though I prefer MakeToy's version).
gingaio Wrote:
> When Jizai first came out with its stuff, I was
> totally onboard with it, too. I think, though,
> once the Henkei Cyclonus came out and I compared
> it to Jizai's, my views on absolute Showiness
> softened a bit.

Don't get me started on Henkei/Classics Cyclonus. I wanted to love it, I wanted it to be perfect - but my heart was broken by the way the design doesn't even try to make the nose and rear center fuselage of the jet mode look right.

There's minimal change possible on the nose, considering how it has to fold inside the robot torso, but they could've at least made the fat part of it it smooth and sleek, without those weird tubular protrusions. I suppose they distract attention from Cyclonus' bunny ears hanging off the bottom of the nose section, but the ears and the back of Cyc's head fit into the silhouette of the jet mode much more smoothly than the little thingers on top!

And the backs of the legs/top of the tail section... I just don't get that. It breaks up the entire shape of the jet mode, calling attention to the fact that it's a pair of folded up objects sitting in between two more folded up objects. It's the opposite of the G1 toy's magnificently continuous jet mode, and it doesn't make it look anything more like the cartoon model.

Any version of the toy looks incredible in robot mode, and the colors are perfect on the version from the American Battle in Space two-pack, but these unaccountable detailing choices really screw up the most aesthetically pleasing imaginary vehicle mode in Transformers history, and that I can not forgive.

I mean, I still bought the toy. I just can't forgive it.

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
No doubt, the jet mode sucks ass, especially when compared to the slick G1 alt mode. That said, as far as a good incarnation of (bot mode) Cyclonus goes, it's really the only option.
Given that Takara is bringing out the coronation Screamer now, my guess is that this is a tip of the hat to what's coming next. The untrained mind might leap to Galvatron, but if you look closely in the reflection of the left eye of the new prototype you can see the blazing reflection of the Galvatron carrying Cyclonus sweeping in toward him. Leaving Cyclonus the obvious choice. Now, here's my only residual question, how much bigger is Cyclonus than Galvatron/Rodimus scalewise?
Supersentai Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Given that Takara is bringing out the coronation
> Screamer now, my guess is that this is a tip of
> the hat to what's coming next. The untrained mind
> might leap to Galvatron, but if you look closely
> in the reflection of the left eye of the new
> prototype you can see the blazing reflection of
> the Galvatron carrying Cyclonus sweeping in toward
> him. Leaving Cyclonus the obvious choice. Now,
> here's my only residual question, how much bigger
> is Cyclonus than Galvatron/Rodimus scalewise?

Cyclonus is one of the worst offenders for scale, considering he stands a hair shorter than Galvatron, but then Galvy fits inside Cyclonus's cockpit in a scene :P A Seeker-sized Masterpiece Cyclonus would be a bizarre choice, but I would actually really dig that. It would probably end up like Hot Rod, though, being far too complicated and fiddly in the name of a super sleek vehicle mode.

Introducing Prometheus Rising Studio.
[prometheusrising.net]
I make 3D printed mecha action figures.
If you notice how much Cyclonus towers over Galvatron in the movie, it's a true testament as to his ultimate loyalty to him that Cyclonus, a presumably comparably powered son of Unicron and no slouch in his own right, tolerated being battered around by Galvatron in his fits of "madness" in the season to follow. For all the posturing Starscream made in his attempts to usurp Megatron's leadership, I would guess that at anytime Cyclonus would have had both the ability and the full support of the remaining cadre of Decepticons if he had knocked him off the throne.
I always liked the conflict that Starscream brought to decepticon ranks although I often wondered why Megatron put up with him, once Megatron became Galvatron I wondered if he would have destroyed him if he wasn't under Unicron's rule although I guess there has to be a final straw. Galvatron never had anyone challenge him, maybe he learned from his mistakes.

If this trend continues a new Megatron will be Masterpiece mp-15. I would really have liked to see a Galvatron in the works.

or

How about this for madness... A new Megatron that converts to Galvatron! It could be a quad changer: From Walter P-38 to Megatron to Galvatron to a space cannon. and before you balk none of us would have thought TF would have evolved to this level just 10 years ago.
Something akin to Punch/Counterpunch...but really delicate, breaky, and overly-designed...these are the things I wouldn't have imagined we'd have today either.
....Well that goes without saying. The expensive breaky stuff that makes you cringe when others touch it is what makes us enthusiasts..... or stupid whick ever comes first. Take me for instance. EVERYONE has warned me not to get the MP-05 but ya think I'm gonna listen?... nah cause you guys got something that I don't and I feel left out of the bitchin about it.
Marvin Lee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> EVERYONE has warned me not to get the
> MP-05 but ya think I'm gonna listen?... nah cause
> you guys got something that I don't and I feel
> left out of the bitchin about it.


That is one party I guarantee you will regret joining.
Gcrush Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Marvin Lee Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > EVERYONE has warned me not to get the
> > MP-05 but ya think I'm gonna listen?... nah
> cause
> > you guys got something that I don't and I feel
> > left out of the bitchin about it.
>
>
> That is one party I guarantee you will regret
> joining.

Listen to the man. Or better yet, PM Fujikuro and ask him. :)
Marvin Lee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ....Well that goes without saying. The expensive
> breaky stuff that makes you cringe when others
> touch it is what makes us enthusiasts..... or
> stupid whick ever comes first. Take me for
> instance. EVERYONE has warned me not to get the
> MP-05 but ya think I'm gonna listen?... nah cause
> you guys got something that I don't and I feel
> left out of the bitchin about it.

It's not like it's going to rape you in your sleep, but it's not really worth it either. There's plenty of big picture design aspects to hate, but there's also just so many little minor things they made the wrong choice on that you can never be happy with it. Like the face sculpt, or the lack of bicep swivel, or how far off the arm the scope sits so it NEVER looks good as the fusion cannon.

Introducing Prometheus Rising Studio.
[prometheusrising.net]
I make 3D printed mecha action figures.
Prometheum5 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It's not like it's going to rape you in your
> sleep...


That's not how my wallet felt at the time.




NOT THAT MY WALLET CAN'T AFFORD IT.
I won't be satisfied until someone makes a Club Con accessory set for MP Starscream with a tiny 1/60 scale chick in a bikini carrying an even tinier Blaster.

And when they do, I still won't buy it.

-Paul Segal

"Oh, the anger is never far, never far." -SteveH
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